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scheibeler's testimonials - some math help please
#1
Eric Scheibeler has been posting "testimonials" on his site. It's interesting to note that they're nearly all 10-20 years or more old and when "losses" from Amway are declared it includes product purchases for personal use ... but never any offset for no longer buying the same stuff in the stores!

Anyway, I digress. The latest testimonial includes the following -

In 1990, I attained the level of Pearl Direct Distributor*, with a very profitable organization. That is, I had twenty personally sponsored distributors, and nine were actively building their organizations. Two had gone direct, i.e., attained the level of Direct Distributor, and the other seven were Silver Producers (their organizations included at least one Direct, but they themselves hadn’t qualified for Direct). My Amway checks included four distinct bonuses for speed of growth, overall volume, profit sharing, and for the number of direct distributors in my organization. My gross income from the Amway corporation–above bonuses plus PV bonuses–peaked at $3300/month.

I have been unable to come up with any scenario in which it is even mathematically possible to be earning only $3300/mth from 20 legs, including 9 at silver. Anyone know when did the leadership bonus go from 3% to 4%? That single bonus alone would account for more than $3300/mth unless virtually every leg was international. What was the PV/BV ration back then?

Furthermore, if he had two personally sponsored directs, and seven other legs that "included at least one Direct", doesn't that make him an Executive Diamond, not Pearl? Confusedcratch:

Something doesn't add up. :confused:
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#2
First of all.... "Direct" used to mean 3 consecutive months at 7500. It was only after someone went "Profit Sharing," (meaning 6 out of 12 months... non-consecutive was ok) that the leg would count as a leg for Emerald or Diamond. That is why he would not have been at a higher pin. Those legs were not in qualification for six months in the year.

Secondly, when he says "Direct" he means someone who "once hit that pin" even if it was 2-5-10 years ago. He is talking about the "perpetual pin" of Direct. Most likely those people were no longer Directs, only people who wore the pin and were recognized on stage because of a certain three month period 2-10 years ealier.

Timing is important. Depending on the timing of each qualification, you could get three seperate Direct legs and never even be Pearl or Sapphire. Because all three have to hit in the same month. You could also get ten different Direct legs in a year but never go Emerald. If three of them did not qualify six months out of the year.

Theoretically he could have gotten an orgainzation with several several Direct but not Profit Sharing legs by going on a large Direct Distributor push which got over the top for three months straight, before falling back to their proper level. All along, never qualifying for Profit Sharing (Platinum) and never counting towards a qualifying leg.

The main mistake in your math is assuming that the Directs in each leg are still in qualification. My guess is that they were no longer qualified and were sitting with ten cases of cookware in their basement.

(Still its hard to believe he got seven out of seven non-Direct legs to go for the deal).
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#3
Ok, well that means his description is extremely misleading in anycase.

That's something I always wondered but never chased up to confirm - when someone qualified Direct, which meant they dealt directly with Amway, was that "right" ever rescinded? Once upon a time wasn't "Direct" qualification just one month at Silver?
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#4
Sure, Amway would "recind" the priviledge of dealing directly with the company.

But the next person upline could still make you eligible for "drop ship" which would give the appearance to your group that you were still a Direct (Platinum) with Amway.

"Direct" was always a very loose term. No, a Silver was not a person with whom Amway had a "Direct" relationship. So they were never Directs as far as the company was concerned.

But at the rally, when the Diamonds said, "Let's get all Directs on stage!" they WERE considered Directs.

My guess is that the Harteis organization was desperately pushing those seven other legs to try to get at least one over the top to make Scheibler Emerald.

On the last day of the month, the organization would have a "push order" to get someone upline over the top. Buy a water treatment system, buy pots/pans, etc. Put a 25 percent bonus on a big ticket item. Start at the bottom. Once you get that order, you call the next one up. "You are only 100 PV from the next bonus bracket" .... there's another $200 order. Then the next person upline "You should buy those pots and pans. They will make you a new 1500 PVer"

Before too long you moved ten pots and pans and lots of side product and have a new Silver producer.

Do it three months in a row and you have a new Direct. Then you would try and get in six months before the whole thing collapsed.

BTW, you can't blame Eric Scheibler for this. He did not create this system. And he could not get on the phone and start calling up from the bottom of the organization asking for a purchase of a case of Double X or a set of pots and pans to help himself hit the next level. It had to come from his upline.
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#5
ibofightback Wrote:Once upon a time wasn't "Direct" qualification just one month at Silver?


I don't know. Maybe Deb would.
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#6
Just to clarify, this was a testimonial Scheibeler published, not his own "story".

This comment of yours had me curious though -

Quote:And he could not get on the phone and start calling up from the bottom of the organization asking for a purchase of a case of Double X or a set of pots and pans to help himself hit the next level. It had to come from his upline.

Why not? Why?
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#7
ibofightback Wrote:Just to clarify, this was a testimonial Scheibeler published, not his own "story".

This comment of yours had me curious though -

Quote:And he could not get on the phone and start calling up from the bottom of the organization asking for a purchase of a case of Double X or a set of pots and pans to help himself hit the next level. It had to come from his upline.

Why not? Why?


Yes. This whole scenario is my guess of how he could get an weird organization like that.

Regarding the Push Order... Of course he "could" do it. But it's hard to ask people in your group to buy a set of pots and pans to help YOU get to a new level. It sounds too self-serving.

You say to low level IBO: "Buy this cookware so you can go 1000 PV."

They hear: "Put these pots and pan on my credit card so you can go Emerald!"

It is easier coming from a third party, escpecially if you get a call from the upline. This would sound lots better and generate a lot more PV:

Linda Harteis: "We are so excited about what is happening down in your group." (Wife is waving arms motioning to her husband... "OMG!! Linda Harteis is on the phone!")

Linda continues: "Tonight is very special. We are going to break some new pins tonight, and we want you to be one of them. Let's see where you are on the bonus schedule. You are only a few hundred PV away from 1500. Let's see what we can do to get you to the next bonus level."

Low level ibo reaches for the credit card.

(Again, this is not Eric Scheibler's story. It's just another guess as to how their organization worked.)
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#8
Why not do what I did one push?

We had a big goal one month and as part of it we offered a $100 cash back (or something like that) on every espring purchased that month in our group. Bunches of them got bought - mostly retailed it must be noted and lots happened, lots of downline qualified at new levels, plus made retail profit. We calculated before hand how much we could afford to offer as cash back and not lose money on the esprings, and reaching a new level increased our bonuses on all the other volume (not to mention all the folk still buying replacement filters).

These kind of offers are a standard marketing practice that doesn't require any self-serving begging nor inventory loading.

As an aside, teaching in N21 is to never ask downline to do something for someone else's goal. To a certain extent it happens naturally of course (and there's probably times the teaching is violated in N21), but I can see lots of reasons psychologically why it would be a bad thing to ask, even from further upline.

Was the approach you dsecribe common in your LOS?
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#9
Yeah, that was pretty much how we did it.

I think the whole thing depends on how it is done.

If the upline knows the situation of the people they are calling and TRULY has those low level ibos' best interests in mind, then there is probably nothing wrong with it. (Does this newlywed couple REALLY need a new set of pots and pans, when they were just given one for their wedding? Is the couple going to be skipping a house payment or a car payment for this purchase? That kind of thing....)

When the upline has no idea of the financial situation of the person they are calling, there is a lot of room for abuse, especially in a LOA that is very rigid with the "loyalty and unity" thing.
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#10
ibofightback Wrote:Anyone know when did the leadership bonus go from 3% to 4%?


The Leadership Bonus was increased from 3% to 4% in 1991.

Some statistics:

The largest Leadership Bonus paid in any month at the 3% level to date (1991) was $10,908. The average Leadership Bonus earned during the fiscal year 1990 was $573.

The largest Performance bonus paid in any month to date (1991) was $47,720. The average Performance Bonus earned during the fiscal year 1990 was $1,165.

In 1991, Amway increased the Pearl Bonus from 0.5% to 1%. The largest 0.5% Pearl Bonus paid in any month to date (1991) was $8,078. The average 0.5% Pearl Bonus earned during the fiscal year 1990 was $580.

And remember, these dollars represent 1990 dollars. $3,300 in 1990 = $5,453 in 2009. Take the inflation into account and consider the bonus increases (3%->4%, 0.5%->1%).
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