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I still think it is a pyramid scheme...
#1
Funny little video on youtube. What's sad is that I've had a similar discussion with people! What's even sadder is that I've talked to other network marketers, who do what I do but with other companies, and they still consider my Amway business a pyramid scheme but they don't feel the same about their business model. Seriously!! :blink:

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#2

Some ppl are funny and ignorant. They seem to conveniently 4get the investigation the FTC did back in 1979. They spent 7 years investigating Amway for operating an alleged illegal pyramid. After 7 long years and million$ of $$$'s later, Amway was cleared as not being an illegal "pyramid scheme".

Now Amway IS a pyramid, it's simple not an illegal pyramid (scheme). It's a legal pyramid. :thumbsup:

Furthermore pyramids are not all bad. I challenge any one to show me ANY major corp in this country that isnt set up like a "pyramid".
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#3
There is no such thing as a "legal pyramid" if you're talking about business schemes. Saying so just provides ammo to critics.
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#4
ibofightback Wrote:There is no such thing as a "legal pyramid" if you're talking about business schemes. Saying so just provides ammo to critics.

Tell that to Ron Puryear, he's the one who came up with the concept/claim.

He has taught from a WorldWide stage that when one accuses Amway of being a "pyramid" an IBO should agree with them, followed by providing some proper education: Amway IS in fact a pyramid, that Amway has the structure of being a pyramid. However, the way it conducts busine$$ makes it a "legal" pyramid.

From what I have learned, in an illegal pyramid, value travel$ up the pyramid with little to no value traveling down the pyramid.

Also in an illegal pyramid, one can buy a position.

One can clearly see that Amway do not fit these descriptions. So the key is not arguing with someone (and we know how U love to argue! lol :grinSmile but rather engage in educating them in the differences, Ron Puryear style! :thumbsup:
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#5
Not to take away from Ron, nor to champion IBOFB's position of not better arming the willfully ignorant (read: stupid), as nothing "works" all the time for all the people...

...but why, oh why, would one intentionally draw someone closer to the overwhelmingly negative picture people have of "pyramids" as it relates to business, legal or not?

I'd ask why they say it's a pyramid scheme, and then try two or three times to help them understand why this isn't one.

Should that fail, I simply exit stage-left and pray I didn't catch what they've got. Wink

In that sense, the video nailed it.

There's no cure for stupid, ya' know...
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#6
Multimillionaire Wrote:
ibofightback Wrote:There is no such thing as a "legal pyramid" if you're talking about business schemes. Saying so just provides ammo to critics.

Tell that to Ron Puryear, he's the one who came up with the concept/claim.

He has taught from a WorldWide stage that when one accuses Amway of being a "pyramid" an IBO should agree with them, followed by providing some proper education:


Perhaps Ron's point is to not argue with the person, ala Dale Carnegie's "How to Win Friends and Influence People."
Dale's, "If I were in your shoes, I'd see it that way."


Dale's "feel, felt, found" method..."I hear what you are saying. You are saying the shape is in a triangle. Yes, that's how the Amway Business can look, like a triangle. And I too once confused the shape of an organization with the legal term 'pyramid.' And here is what I found...."
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#7
Bridgett Wrote:
Multimillionaire Wrote:
ibofightback Wrote:There is no such thing as a "legal pyramid" if you're talking about business schemes. Saying so just provides ammo to critics.

Tell that to Ron Puryear, he's the one who came up with the concept/claim.

He has taught from a WorldWide stage that when one accuses Amway of being a "pyramid" an IBO should agree with them, followed by providing some proper education:


Perhaps Ron's point is to not argue with the person, ala Dale Carnegie's "How to Win Friends and Influence People."
Dale's, "If I were in your shoes, I'd see it that way."


Dale's "feel, felt, found" method..."I hear what you are saying. You are saying the shape is in a triangle. Yes, that's how the Amway Business can look, like a triangle. And I too once confused the shape of an organization with the legal term 'pyramid.' And here is what I found...."

Excellent approach Bridgett, thank u 4 your reminder and your input. :clapping:

Indeed "feel, felt, found" has been around for a l-o-n-g-g time.

I was taught the strategy back in the early '80's. "I know how u feel Joe, blah, blah, blah...I felt the same way, and I'd like to share with you what I found out....blah, blah, blah". (Short and condensed version, aka...the basic principle.) I learned the approach from an old Bob Crisp tape.
:thumbsup:
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#8
Multimillionaire Wrote:
ibofightback Wrote:There is no such thing as a "legal pyramid" if you're talking about business schemes. Saying so just provides ammo to critics.

Tell that to Ron Puryear, he's the one who came up with the concept/claim.

He has taught from a WorldWide stage that when one accuses Amway of being a "pyramid" an IBO should agree with them, followed by providing some proper education: Amway IS in fact a pyramid, that Amway has the structure of being a pyramid. However, the way it conducts busine$$ makes it a "legal" pyramid.

From what I have learned, in an illegal pyramid, value travel$ up the pyramid with little to no value traveling down the pyramid.

Also in an illegal pyramid, one can buy a position.

One can clearly see that Amway do not fit these descriptions. So the key is not arguing with someone (and we know how U love to argue! lol :grinSmile but rather engage in educating them in the differences, Ron Puryear style! :thumbsup:


If that's what Puryear was teaching, he was wrong. Hopefully he has since learned better.

The key definition of a pyramid is that you get paid for recruiting. The end result is value only travels "up". Buying positions is a separate thing altogether.

If Ron Puryear actually drew out his organisation fully I think he'll find it's not at all pyramid shaped or structured. The traditional method of showing the plan is, but it does not reflect reality.
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#9
Wearyeyed Wrote:Not to take away from Ron, nor to champion IBOFB's position of not better arming the willfully ignorant (read: stupid), as nothing "works" all the time for all the people...

...but why, oh why, would one intentionally draw someone closer to the overwhelmingly negative picture people have of "pyramids" as it relates to business, legal or not?

I'd ask why they say it's a pyramid scheme, and then try two or three times to help them understand why this isn't one.

Should that fail, I simply exit stage-left and pray I didn't catch what they've got. Wink

In that sense, the video nailed it.

There's no cure for stupid, ya' know...


I agree here with Wearyeyed - There is not point in drawing attention to to the word pyramid and even less point in debating it beyond an explanation or two.
I was recently at two presentation of the Sales & Marking Plan in Ireland - one paid for by Amway and one authorised by Amway where the entry fee for ABOs was €5 - different presenters - one male, one female, different lines of sponsorship and both proceeded to explain why Amway was not a pyramid by using the example of a traditional company structure - nobody asked any questions about pyramids or anything of that nature.
The explanations were very similar is drawing with slightly different explanation - why rake up something that should be buried?
'The only way I can succeed in business is to proactively do something for 'MY BUSINESS' every day'
I look to the Future - for the Future is where I'm going to spend the rest of my Life
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#10
Had the same issue here. I suspect Frank Luntz, who I believe has been bought in by Amway training Diamonds, may help get rid of that habit in the US.

Marketing 101 tells you not to bring up associations you don't want.
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