Amway Talk

I'm a new IBO. I just joined about three weeks ago, and every time I get with my upline and everything I get totally pumped about the business, but then I come home and google it and read all the negative stuff all over and it's a real downer. I get to wondering if I made the right decision. I see how I can make money, but then I wonder if by I'm causing other people to lose money by bringing them into the business. It's just difficult. I have noticed though that most negative blogs and things aren't very recent, so that helps a bit. I'm not totally sure where I'm going with this but basically I'm just looking for some encouragement as I start out. Also, could I get some slight clarification on the whole "Diamonds make most of their money on selling books and tapes" ordeal because that seems to be one of the most popular arguments. Thank you very much.

Hi Beans!

Hint #1 - don't read all the negative sites As you noted they're often extremely outdated. You'll also find that any first hand experiences nearly all come from the same group, so even back then it was only part of Amway causing these issues! Check out sites like http://www.amwaywatch.com and http://www.amwaywiki.comfor lots of facts and info that will make you proud to be affiliated with Amway! There's also at least one critic (JoeCool) who has been caught posting fake stories around the 'net pretending to be an IBO and telling "horror" stories. Frankly I think we should sue his butt off. Another, Tex, is an obsessive compulsive who ignores all evidence that doesn't fit with his obsession. He believes what he wants to believe, to hell with reality.

So re Diamonds and tool income. It's mostly a myth. Like most myths though, it has some truth. Do some Diamonds and above make more money from tools than Amway? Yup, particular if one includes the opportunities available to earn $$$$ as a professional speaker outside of your own Amway group. Is it common? Not that I can tell. Again when you look at the history, including various lawsuits on this topic, they all originated in the same group and it's offshoots! That group is a minority of Amway, yet now folk are claiming what they did was common everywhere. If it was, then why no complaints and lawsuits etc for the other groups, which together make up by far the majority of the Amway world? Makes no sense.

"Critics" also claim that Diamonds lifestyles are funded by this tool income and not Amway income - however every single time I have challenged critics to name Diamonds with lavious lifestyles that couldn't be afforded on a Diamond income - they can't give me any! They instead name Triple Diamonds and Crowns and Crown Ambassadors - all folks with very very large Amway incomes. A few years ago it was reported that the average income for Founders EDC and above was well over $1,000,000. There's not much lifestlye that can't be bought for that amount!

So keep that in mind - the average incomes for Diamonds and above that's published is just Amway income. Any decision about whether to build Amway or not should be based on that income, and for most folk it should be incentive enough.

In any case, in order to help clear up the conclusion, Amway in the US has implemented "accreditation" rules to make sure everyone operates professionally in this area. Those same standards are now being implemented around the world.

I'll be doing some posts soon on my blog, http://www.thetruthaboutamway.com, to help folk understand this area of controversy a little better.

First, treat this like a REAL business. Be very careful with your expenditures. Don't feel rushed to buy every new tool promoted from stage. And expecially don't buy into this: "... and if you are a REAL leader, you will buy extra so your group will have them."

This will go against what you are taught by your upline but THINK FOR YOURSELF!

Most likely your upline is not willing to make your car payment, pay your insurance or house payment if you fail to meet your obligations because of your business expenses. So don't take financial counseling from them, expecially when it's in their self intrests for you to be at a convention or to buy a quantity of tools.

And don't avoid the "negative" websites. Your upline may (or may not) be one of those who have had problems.

Even if your upline is not one of those who have abused the system, it is still healthy to be aware of the warning signals.

MichMan wrote:This will go against what you are taught by your upline but THINK FOR YOURSELF!

wow .... how many million "upline" are there in the world? And MichMan KNOWS, no matter which of the millions are your upline, he KNOWS what they're going to tell you!!! All of them!!

of course, I've never been told that. Clearly I must have no upline

Even if your upline is not one of those who have abused the system, it is still healthy to be aware of the warning signals.

Sure, be aware, but going back and revisiting them sites is not necessary nor healthy.

Oh ... and Beans ... just in case you didn't notice, MichMan is a former IBO.

Yeah, they always teach you to think for yourself. (rolling eyes)

How many times have we heard from stage, "You really need to be at the next function... if you have it in your budget. Also, make sure your expenditures are balanced with your income then go back and track the progress you made since the last convention and see if you received any benefit from it. But only then should you consider it."

MichMan wrote:Yeah, they always teach you to think for yourself. (rolling eyes)

Unlike you, MichMan, I believe it's actually possible not all of the millions of upline are the same. They perhaps not *all* teach you to think for yourself, and they perhaps not *all* teach you not to.

MichMan wrote:How many times have we heard from stage, "You really need to be at the next function... if you have it in your budget. Also, make sure your expenditures are balanced with your income then go back and track the progress you made since the last convention and see if you received any benefit from it. But only then should you consider it."

Why would you? That's clearly bad advice. Virtually any expert in goal setting will tell you not to set goals based on where you are now. You set the goal, then work out how to get there from where you are now.

Welcome Beans,

My advice is to be careful from who you take advice.

I am a mentally tough IBO who knows this business pretty well (at least in the North American market) and even I can be affected by all the crud from the negative sites.

They are called "negative" for a reason. I agree with IBOFB to avoid them. Why? Because I view them as a party I've wandered in to that are crowded with people I'd prefer not to "hang" with. I think to myself, if I encountered these people and this conversation in the real world, would I stand here listening or would I walk away?

At some point, you are going to have to decide if you are gonna build your business or you are gonna get caught up in the drama online.

Credibility is also key. Who are all of us online? And why would you listen to so-and-so over so-and-so? Are they talking fact or opinion? What are their motives? How do they operate? Are they people you'd like to be like?

I did a blog post recently which has nothing to do with the Amway/Amway Global business, but it does address some of the online/technology "issues" which may apply to the online conversation of the Amway/Amway Global business.
http://www.bridgettbridgett.blogspot.com/ (February 3rd, 2009 entry)

Again, welcome Beans!

Hi Beans - welcome to the business - it is important to know that the majority of IBOs/ABOs have a rise & fall in emotions about the business in the early stages.
Your upline is normally first port of call for advice and leadershp and if you don't get what you are looking for then go upline again to an active Platinum or above.
If you think you need another prospective this is one of the best places to come to ask a question and post a comment because most replies are fairly balanced and if they are not they will be after a few of the bloggers get going.
You say you are a new IBO then I assume you are not in the UK/ROI market where we are called ABOs - which market are you in??
Enjoy your roller coaster ride because like any business you will have your ups & downs but remember in this business you have no Stock, Premises, Rent, Rates, Staff, Service Charges, etc etc etc - Good Luck.
Here are my blogs from an UK/ROI point of view and don't forget all the fantastic Amway websites which you can link on to.
http://amwayukirelandfacts.wordpress.com
http://networkmarketingroi.blogspot.com/

First, Beans...welcome to the forum here and on starting your business. You will find a lot of good info and experiences from different folks here, on a whole range of topics. A few things in the posts here I am going to comment on.

MichMan wrote:First, treat this like a REAL business. Be very careful with your expenditures. Don't feel rushed to buy every new tool promoted from stage. And expecially don't buy into this: "... and if you are a REAL leader, you will buy extra so your group will have them."

Michman is partially correct. You do need to treat it like a REAL business, to make it successful. That is assuming your definition of success is Platinum and beyond. It may not be...when you first get started it may only be to make a few hundred bucks. In my opinion, where Michman is wrong, you need to buy into the education provided for you. Of course, know your budget and use discretionary income (could come from extracurricular activities--sports leagues, cable TV, drinking, starbucks coffee trips, smokes). Most people do not think about these things. If you are to treat it like a REAL business, then being properly equipped is part of a REAL business. If you are a builder, you don't show up to someone's house to fix something and ask to borrow the home owner's tools, correct?

That being said, your upline should give you a bunch of stuff to read and listen to for free, plus their own personal time away from their family, friends, and other people on their team (appreciate that help and use it effectively).

Also, this is key as well. If you have a question about ANYTHING, especially negative stuff, ASK IT of your upline. Get the skinny from their mouth, not from people on the internet. Don't be afraid to ask questions, and if your immediate upline can't answer it for you, or to your satisfaction, go further upline until you do. Again, do not be afraid to ask.

This will go against what you are taught by your upline but THINK FOR YOURSELF!

Be careful with statements like this from folks that either have never been an IBO or do not have what you want (ie. a failed business). Nothing against Michman, he is a smart guy and contributes to this forum frequently. Think for yourself....true, but don't confuse "thinking for yourself" with always go against what you are being taught. If you do, you will be very confused and go no where in your business. Developing a personalized game plan with your upline will be the most beneficial.

Most likely your upline is not willing to make your car payment, pay your insurance or house payment if you fail to meet your obligations because of your business expenses. So don't take financial counseling from them, expecially when it's in their self intrests for you to be at a convention or to buy a quantity of tools.

This is a very counter intuitive statement as well Beans. If you want to make this work, you need to be in touch with your "GROWING" upline...preferably an Emerald or at the very least Platinum. At your job, will your boss and/or coworkers pay anything for you?? Probably not, so why would a person expect it from their upline??

However, to get the best advice, you should develop a trust with that upline so you are comfortable with telling them your finances. This is probably one of the biggest problems I see in my business. Folks are not honest with their upline about their finances, so they in turn receive "bad advice". Had the upline known exactly what the financial situation was, there would usually be a whole different approach and advice given.

And don't avoid the "negative" websites. Your upline may (or may not) be one of those who have had problems.
Even if your upline is not one of those who have abused the system, it is still healthy to be aware of the warning signals.

My thought on this...is you should avoid the negative sites. Just like you typically avoid negative people at work, family, and anywhere else. It does nothing but bring you down, which in turn shows up in your attitude and demeanor. This site does a great job with bringing up the typical negative stuff and dispelling the vast majority of myths. Understand the internet makes things seem much more convoluted then they really are.

Just remember, Beans, no one on this forum or any negative site has your interest in mind. So be careful with whom you take advice. Work with those folks that you can sit across the table in person with you. It will be much more beneficial for you.

Hello Beans,

Welcome to the business. I agree with the others about avoiding the negative sites. Especially since you are new and don't have a lot of knowledge yet that would allow you to recoginze truth from fiction. Stick with the positive material. You will find a lot of that here on the threads related to the Amway business. There are other threads that have a more non-business theme and things can get kind of heated on those threads as we all have differing political/religous/personal opinions.

The only other thing I can think of to say is don't load yourself down with a lot of books/cd's etc. that you don't have the extra money to really afford. Your upline probably has books/cd's etc. that you can borrow for a while to get you motivated. As you start making money, then you can afford to invest in your own material. The public library is a good place to get motivational books to read by authors like Zig Ziglar, Stephen Covey,, John Maxwell and others.

Wish you all the best in this business. God Bless!

Dwight